Topic: My thoughts on this contentious matter

First of all it has to be said that the cruising industry has practices like no other holiday industry. There are certain parallels that can be drawn but in essence this industry is different.
Firstly gratuities or tips are not given for service over and above the norm they are given as part of parcel of the expected cruise cost. Secondly it has become an established fact that crew members rely on the tips that they receive to make up the majority of a highly insubstantial basic wage. And lastly it benefits the cruise lines to expect us to pay the gratuities for many financial and possibly reprehensible reasons.
So by not paying your expected amount of gratuities does not encumber the cruise lines, except when the grumbling of the staff mean that they have to take notice, but does harm financially the guys and gals who work very hard, long hours to make sure we want for nothing.
There are many excuses made, and we have heard them all, for not paying what is expected but I and many others believe that whilst the system is as it is, it is unthinkable not to pay gratuities as expected. It is certainly time that it was recognised that gratuities should be renamed “Service Charge” and included as a tax on the invoice as are Port Charges and Airport Taxes and we believe that this is gradually coming about and in the future this will be accepted as the norm and then maybe a small gratuity could given to a person because they have excelled themselves so that a gratuity becomes just that, an acknowledgement and thanks for service given.
So please continue to make a point of saying to the cruise lines that we do not like the current situation and that we would like to see a major change of policy on their part as soon as possible. That way they can feel the animosity that the current system engenders and by making them change make both staff and passengers happy. …… Neil

Neil you know I for one am with you 100% on this issue, as I’m sure everyone on this forum is. I always make a big point on the end of cruise comment card about building grats into the cruise price, and of late using words such as Barbaric, Antiquated and Obscene in an attempt to draw attention. My only further comment to your suggestion is that the ‘Advertised Price’ must be the ‘Total Price’ fully inclusive, no additions beyond that. That’ll sort some of the eegits out of late, who admit to handing over a Fiver or worse still, not tipping at all……….Wilba

QUOTE:

Neil you know I for one am with you 100% on this issue, as I’m sure everyone on this forum is. I always make a big point on the end of cruise comment card about building grats into the cruise price, and of late using words such as Barbaric, Antiquated and Obscene in an attempt to draw attention. My only further comment to your suggestion is that the ‘Advertised Price’ must be the ‘Total Price’ fully inclusive, no additions beyond that. That’ll sort some of the eegits out of late, who admit to handing over a Fiver or worse still, not tipping at all……….Wilba

Thanks Wilba, and yes I know we are as one here and you are quite right with your point of a "Total Price"

It makes me shudder when I realise that some people are willing to short-change others just because they can personally benefit and who disregard others who are not in a position to do anything about it. The stock phrase " I don't like to be told what I must do" is pure poppycock and solely a let out for folk who pretend to have principles but just do not.

The reason I set out this stand is really for the newcomers to the site who may not realise the significance of the tipping system and to try to get people into a frame of mind where change can be achieved (without bloodshed)

We know we are going to get the objectionable objectors along with those who feel they have a genuine case but we have to show that there is reason for what we say and ask people to do. Amen. .......Neil

I think your comments about a 'total price' Wilba are spot on...and I know I always go on a bit about Thomson but the price you pay for their cruises is the 'total price' and their staff are the happiest we've seen afloat (so we assume they are getting a decent wage)....it seems to me that the companies that charge gratuities (service charge) use it as an excuse to pay their staff poor wages which is what makes me cross....I might add we always pay a decent tip/gratuity/service charge but many don't, and several on our table on Brilliance did not pay anything...noticeably the Australians who said 'they don't tip at all'!

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I think your comments about a 'total price' Wilba are spot on...and I know I always go on a bit about Thomson but the price you pay for their cruises is the 'total price' and their staff are the happiest we've seen afloat (so we assume they are getting a decent wage)....it seems to me that the companies that charge gratuities (service charge) use it as an excuse to pay their staff poor wages which is what makes me cross....I might add we always pay a decent tip/gratuity/service charge but many don't, and several on our table on Brilliance did not pay anything...noticeably the Australians who said 'they don't tip at all'!

I would like just to say your comment about Thomson staff is spot on. One of the excuses given by cruise lines and indeed many Americans is that if you take away the incentive of gratuities you get a poorer service and so many times I have found that is is just untrue and that someone who gets paid well enjoys what they do and do it well. If they don't then I have always said you must look at the management for it is the main cause of poor service.
Well said. ........Neil

QUOTE:

I would like just to say your comment about Thomson staff is spot on. One of the excuses given by cruise lines and indeed many Americans is that if you take away the incentive of gratuities you get a poorer service and so many times I have found that is is just untrue and that someone who gets paid well enjoys what they do and do it well. If they don't then I have always said you must look at the management for it is the main cause of poor service.
Well said. ........Neil

I too have witnessed first hand 'No Tipping' lines. I did a couple of Star Cruise in the Far East. The service was out of this world, easily on a par with Celebrity & the likes, as Neil says, service comes down to man management, quality training, & a pride in their Company standards.

I agree with the previous comments - wonder if anyone will disagree? I just want the price of my cruise to include any service charges and to know that the people looking after me are being paid fairly. I tip the staff who have been especially kind and caring, which can sometimes get a bit out of hand. Last year, on the last night my husband failed to locate Nelson, lovely waiter in the theatre, and he still feels guilty 11 months on. This year, his intention is to find Nelson and tip him first! The joys of a small ship. Judith

Judith, Judith, Judith, I wish there were far more people in the world like you and himself.
But, don't worry about wondering whether everyone will think the same as we do, when the gates of this Forum are open I think that the opposing views will come flooding in from several quarters.

Regards .... Neil

Neil, I do agree with you (and Wilba) in the main, PROVIDING the cruise companies just quote a total cost. If it were to state this includes compulsory gratuities of £xxx, this is where it would rankle with me. I would rather not know and just be informed this is the total cost of the cruise and have it stated that no tipping is encouraged.
I really do not like being told how much to tip. I do not like being told whom to tip. I do tip but I please myself whom and how much. Sometimes I see a fairer way of distributing my tips, particularly where my children are concerned.
Where suggested amounts or automatic gratuities are imposed, how do we really know its distributed as they state, (they say its x amount for the main waiter, x amount for the assistant waiter and x amount for the cabin attendant) when in fact we are told by others that its to top up the wages of the poor guys who work in the background that we don’t see – so they are fooling us! If they are telling me they are charging me $50 for the waiter I want to know that all of that $50 is going to the waiter (not part of it to some guy working in the engine room). This is why I put money in peoples hands. For me personally it’s purely a principle issue. I know there will always be those that will want to wriggle out of paying gratuities.
But having it your way the cruise lines are in a win win situation because there will be some (like me) who just don’t feel right about walking away at the end of a cruise without putting something into someones hand. Therefore the likes of me (and probably yourself) will end up paying twice!

i agree with majority here, lets have an all encompassing cruise price, i pay grads upfront and automatically consider it part of the price. i do question bradbury, he may want to tip the waiter etc but not the engine hand, a ships is the sum of all parts and not just the front facing staff. How do we get the cruise companies to change?